APR Stage 1 vs Unitronic Stage 1+

[Dog Dad Wagon]

No "stage 2" car can be legal in CARB type states.

Anything more than Stage 1 is a fun money suck hobby. Stage 1 is the way the car should have come from the factory.

agreed. It’s unreal to me the 34-3500lb Alltrack/GSW 4Mo comes with 170HP/184TQ from the factory

 

[EpicTech]

Thank you kindly everyone who chimed in and gave me something to think about. I’m leaning heavily (75-80%) towards APR but feel like a lil more info is needed. Like I’ve read that some ppl stay at 87 while some go to 89 or 91. I know change would be needed if my engine started knocking due to the fuel I’d be using in that case ofc. Those of you who have or had APR stage 1, what fuel “level” (<-definitely wrong term but y’all know what I mean ) did you use and did it start knocking from said fuel “mix

My GTI is Unitronic Stage 2, with over 75k on the clock and full bolt ons. I run 93 octane and every 3rd tank I run a bottle of Lucas oil octane booster. I have 1 degree colder plugs and upgraded coil packs. The car runs flawless and power is smooth. When I added the Mishimoto IC and charge pipes, I re-dyno'd the car and it made 338hp/389 torque, on a very hot southern Texas day I might add. I get consistent 32-34 mpg.

-Hope this helps.

 

[MrsPhoenix]

My GTI is Unitronic Stage 2, with over 75k on the clock and full bolt ons. I run 93 octane and every 3rd tank I run a bottle of Lucas oil octane booster. I have 1 degree colder plugs and upgraded coil packs. The car runs flawless and power is smooth. When I added the Mishimoto IC and charge pipes, I re-dyno'd the car and it made 338hp/389 torque, on a very hot southern Texas day I might add. I get consistent 32-34 mpg.

-Hope this helps.

It does help but I’m not going past stg 1 cuz I wanna keep other things as close to stock as possible. The only other things I’m changing are the front and rear anti sway bars. Got new spark plugs already, too, BUT considering red coils instead since my car is white, black, and red.

 

[tigeo]

This... and if I ever go IS38 (which is the plan) id support the turbo upgrade with DP/clutch/IC... and I am APR stage 1 91. This means i'll have to go the Uni route if I want to take this next step.

IS38 with stock DP is fine and all, but not overly appealing for me. Uni stage 1 by all accounts is potato/potato but it offers you ceiling on the tune upgrade path. That's all i'm saying.

APR stage 3 IS38 works with a DP...

 

[tigeo]

It does help but I’m not going past stg 1 cuz I wanna keep other things as close to stock as possible. The only other things I’m changing are the front and rear anti sway bars. Got new spark plugs already, too, BUT considering red coils instead since my car is white, black, and red.

Time to hit the "regular" Golf forum or the Alltrack/Sportwagen FB group. So much info here. APR vs. Uni - lots of folks on both tunes happy as clams. The differences:

Uni has flash-at home capability. APR is all through dealers.
Uni's Uniconnect+ cable is $150 extra to flash at home and does allow logging. Limits are that you can't download the logs (only can upload to Uni's service for tech support) to use for Datazap but their viewer is good and should allow at-home troubleshooting.
Uni runs more timing advance/less boost vs. APR that is more boost/less timing. What does that mean? Uni will be more sensitive to fuel quality. APR will push the turbo harder.
APR nixed their "stage 2" tune which was the IS12 (stock) turbo add downpipe. APR still supports the upgraded IS20 and 38 tune and has downpipe files for both. This is now called "stage 3". So much bad info out there on this. Unitronic still has a IS12 stage 2 tune. I see this as a non-issue b/c if you are adding a DP presumably to go "FBO bRo" you would be upgrading your turbo anyway...the power add is the DP, not the tune on the 1.8 as far I can tell.
Unitronic can take advantage of a little bit of ethanol (E20-30 depending on tune/hardware) to gain more power b/c of their timing-focused tune.
Both are larger tuners that have substantial R&D on VAG cars.
They both have proven track records on the 1.8 with lots of users on both tuning companies.

What do I run? I've had Unitronic software on my 4Motion DSG Sportwagen since 3K miles after buying new 3 years ago. About 10 mos. with their Stage 1+/Stage 1 TCU tunes. 1 year on the Stage 2 IS20 tune, and now have been on their Stage 2+ IS38/Stage 2 TCU tune (with all the supporting hardware - DP, IC, intake, charge pipes, United Haldex tune, blah blah blah) for the last year. Fantastic software and solid support if you need it. I've dragged it and tracked it. My wagon rips. I've spent time on the road hooning with folks on the corresponding APR IS38 tune in their GSWs/ATs, they are basically the same performance-wise. Pretty hard to argue with my 1/4 mile performance numbers in my signature...I think those sit at the top of the Dragy leaderboad for the wagons over on the "vs." sub-forum if they've updated it recently which of course only means someone with APR hasn't spent the time like I have to get those numbers, I'm sure an APR IS38 in my conditions would be similar.

 

[ZuMBLe]

Time to hit the "regular" Golf forum or the Alltrack/Sportwagen FB group. So much info here. APR vs. Uni - lots of folks on both tunes happy as clams. The differences:

Uni has flash-at home capability. APR is all through dealers.
Uni runs more timing advance/less boost vs. APR that is more boost/less timing. What does that mean? Uni will be more sensitive to fuel quality. APR will push the turbo harder.
APR nixed their "stage 2" tune which was the IS12 (stock) turbo add downpipe. APR still supports the upgraded IS20 and 38 tune and has downpipe files for both. This is now called "stage 3". So much bad info out there on this. Unitronic still has a IS12 stage 2 tune. I see this as a non-issue b/c if you are adding a DP presumably to go "FBO bRo" you would be upgrading your turbo anyway.
Unitronic can take advantage of a little bit of ethanol (E20-30 depending on tune/hardware) to gain more power b/c of their timing-focused tune.
Both are larger tuners that have substantial R&D on VAG cars.
They both have proven track records on the 1.8 with lots of users on both tuning companies.

What do I run? I've had Unitronic software on my 4Motion DSG Sportwagen since 3K miles after buying new 3 years ago. About 10 mos. with their Stage 1+/Stage 1 TCU tunes. 1 year on the Stage 2 IS20 tune, and now have been on their Stage 2+ IS38/Stage 2 TCU tune (with all the supporting hardware - DP, IC, intake, charge pipes, United Haldex tune, blah blah blah) for the last year. Fantastic software and solid support if you need it. I've dragged it and tracked it. My wagon rips. I've spent time on the road hooning with folks on the corresponding APR IS38 tune in their GSWs/ATs, they are basically the same performance-wise. Pretty hard to argue with my 1/4 mile performance numbers in my signature...I think those sit at the top of the Dragy leaderboad for the wagons over on the "vs." sub-forum if they've updated it recently which of course only means someone with APR hasn't spent the time like I have to get those numbers, I'm sure an APR IS38 in my conditions would be similar.

Excellent and informative post. No bullshit there. APR's biggest drawback is no at home flashing. Is the UniConnect cable extra $$? With APR's new pricing, I think APR is cheaper?

 

[Dog Dad Wagon]

Excellent and informative post. No bullshit there. APR's biggest drawback is no at home flashing. Is the UniConnect cable extra $$? With APR's new pricing, I think APR is cheaper?

Yes even with paying a dealer flash time APR is cheaper for Stage 1. And yes Uni’s cable is $150. And it cannot be re-sold to someone else / “unmarried” like an AP.

 

[tigeo]

Excellent and informative post. No bullshit there. APR's biggest drawback is no at home flashing. Is the UniConnect cable extra $$? With APR's new pricing, I think APR is cheaper?

Thanks. I agree; APR no-home flash is kinda of silly IMHO at this point but it seems to work for them with the dealer model. Their tunes/upgrade path is a bit cheaper overall now I believe even adding in some flash labor. I will do the price comparo in a bit.

 

[tigeo]

Yes even with paying a dealer flash time APR is cheaper for Stage 1. And yes Uni’s cable is $150. And it cannot be re-sold to someone else / “unmarried” like an AP.

Also consider Uni's cable allows logging now which is v. good. Challenges are it you need your laptop/cable plugged in to do it while driving AND it only allows viewing and no data download for you, only can upload to Uni's server so some limits. APR doesn't have this.

 

[tigeo]

APR's current reduced pricing for the 1.8:

Stage 1 (87, 91, 93, 100 octane) = $500 + flash labor (going with 1 hour @125 shop rate)
Stage 3 IS20 OR 38 (all fuels) = $250 upgrade charge + flash labor (going with 1 hour @$125 shop rate). Assume if you do the 20 first, it would be another $250 to go 38.
DSG tune = $500

So stage 1 is going to be $1125 all-in. Then another $375 to go up to the IS38.

I believe they aren't doing much in the way of sales now with the reduced pricing (basically it's always on sale now).

Unitronic's current pricing:

Stage 1+ 93 (a bit cheaper for the 91 stage 1 tune) = $600
Stage 2 IS20 from Stage 1+ = $200
Stage 2+IS38 (from IS20) = $200
Stage 2+ from Stage 1+ IS38 = $350
Stage 1 DSG tune = $500
Stage 2 DSG tune (from Stage 1) = $150
Uniconnect+ cable = $150

They do however run sales that package these together etc. for a discounted bundle price. I paid $1150 all-in for my Stage 1+/Stage 1 DSG tune and cable. So effectively the same price as APR for the same thing when labor is factored in.

Uni is bit more to go to the IS38 and upgrade DSG tune b/c they don't discount the upgrades so $350+$150 = $500 vs. $350 for APR.

 

[tigeo]

Yes even with paying a dealer flash time APR is cheaper for Stage 1. And yes Uni’s cable is $150. And it cannot be re-sold to someone else / “unmarried” like an AP.

It's $25 more and may be actually be a complete wash if you buy the Uni package/bundle with the cable per my pricing post above. Will depend on what your APR dealer charges for flashing is really it AND requires that you buy the Uni stuff on sale.

 

[ZuMBLe]

Also consider Uni's cable allows logging now which is v. good. Challenges are it you need your laptop/cable plugged in to do it while driving AND it only allows viewing and no data download for you, only can upload to Uni's server so some limits. APR doesn't have this.

The logging for uni looked good from what I saw. APR actually has a wireless dongle you can purchase for logging, but I think it only works with IOS devices though. Neither is actually super useful because APR and UNI are not user tunable.

 

[ZuMBLe]

Yes even with paying a dealer flash time APR is cheaper for Stage 1. And yes Uni’s cable is $150. And it cannot be re-sold to someone else / “unmarried” like an AP.

I've actually never paid for a APR dealer labor ever. My initial APR flash was at a VW dealership which didn't charge me to flash the tune. I had tune upgrades at a tuner which did not charge me to change my tune because I had other work being done there. Paying labor for a flash really isn't a definite thing.

 

[tigeo]

The logging for uni looked good from what I saw. APR actually has a wireless dongle you can purchase for logging, but I think it only works with IOS devices though. Neither is actually super useful because APR and UNI are not user tunable.

I've used the Uni logging program, it's good and captures tons of data at a v. high frequecy. You can view it on your laptop. Just wish you could download the raw data to nerd out.

 

[tigeo]

I've actually never paid for a APR dealer labor ever. My initial APR flash was at a VW dealership which didn't charge me to flash the tune. I had tune upgrades at a tuner which did not charge me to change my tune because I had other work being done there. Paying labor for a flash really isn't a definite thing.

Agreed - seems hit/miss but I've read of plenty of people paying an hour labor for it. Just something for folks doing a line-by-line compro to be aware of.