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GTEMK8 - Engine needs to keep running issue

jonfl

New member
I was already on 1896 when the message appeared and I'm still with that software version, so it should not fix unfortunately.
The 1896 update is for multiple issues with selecting the Primary profile.

Replacing the 12v battery will hopefully fix the e-mode issue
 

m4in

Go Kart Newbie
It would've been my first guess, actually. I don't have a hybrid (yet, hopefully in 8ish weeks), but start stop systems are similar, in that if the battery falls below a certain charge level, it doesn't turn the engine off. The battery in a ehybrid gets charged by the engine, due to being used to this behaviour from our current car, i'd would assume that it's constantly charging for some reason. Either some current draw when it shouldn't, charging system weak or battery naff.

I bet changing the 12v will fix it.
 

UPL02

New member
Apparently VW say the 12v battery must be changed every 4 years (Hybrid only).
My MK8 is new and has just 7 months... :cry: I heard a friend with an older GTE (+1 year) that said he also got the message, but after a couple of days it disappeared; unfortunately it's not my case.

Replacing the 12v battery will hopefully fix the e-mode issue
I wonder why the car doesn't suggest the battery is low, then.

The battery in a ehybrid gets charged by the engine
If I remember well, according to the user manual the 12V battery should be recharged also when connected to the external power (i.e. when charging the car).
 

jonfl

New member
I bet changing the 12v will fix it.
Fingers crossed! Am quite hopeful 🤞
Apparently VW say the 12v battery must be changed every 4 years (Hybrid only).
Good to know. However mines about 17 months old.
I wonder why the car doesn't suggest the battery is low, then.


If I remember well, according to the user manual the 12V battery should be recharged also when connected to the external power (i.e. when charging the car).
Think this is what’s not helped. Their diagnostic says nothings wrong!

Interesting about the 12v charge. This issue originally happened about six months ago, but after a full charge went away. Only in August did it go wrong permanently.
 

m4in

Go Kart Newbie
If I remember well, according to the user manual the 12V battery should be recharged also when connected to the external power (i.e. when charging the car).

Could very well be, since our current car is petrol only, i wouldn't be able to tell. I can check once they finally deliver our GTE. That said, jonfls message there still convinces me that it's the 12v.

Interesting about the 12v charge. This issue originally happened about six months ago, but after a full charge went away. Only in August did it go wrong permanently.

If it went away after a full charge, and now continues to persist, there's two options from my point of view, and you can test for them (if there's nothing vastly different in a PHEV compared to a petrol in that regard). Take the time, drive your car around, and once you get the dreaded message that the engine can't shut off, drive home, park up and check the battery voltage with a multimeter. This just convinces me more that it's the 12v at fault - either it doesn't take full charge anymore, discharges too fast or there's a big parasitic draw somewhere/for some reason, leading to the same problem of the battery draining too fast.

The only thing i don't quite understand is why you don't get an explanation anywhere. Our car (Ateca, 2019) with MIB2 infotainment does tell us when, in our case, the start stop system is deactivated. Or more precisely, it tells us, at least to some extend, why it's deactivated. In winter, quite often it's because of "high power consumption" when we have heated seats etc going, other times it's the heated windshield being active (it tells us in particular), etc. There should be something similar to that in a Golf with MIB3, no? With an MIB2 system, it's under "Car" and "Info" (maybe Status, can't even recall). From youtube videos, it's the same - from the Menu go to "Car", then to Status, when the message appears. It's kind of a "have you tried turning it on and off again" suggestion, but might as well give it a check if you haven't done so. Maybe you get a pointer at the very least.



Different car, but exact same display as ours. Car tells us there why the start stop ain't working. Instead of "No Entries" we get told "heated windscreen active", "high power consumption" etc.
 

UPL02

New member
check the battery voltage with a multimeter
I still have to understand where the 12V battery is on the eHybrid. Certainly not in the front hood, probably on the rear side? Measuring the voltage without knowing where to put the probes is not easy.
Different car, but exact same display as ours. Car tells us there why the start stop ain't working.
I also though to check that screen when the popup appeared: there was nothing. Of course it was like that, because it is not considered a warning or an alarm.
The only thing i don't quite understand is why you don't get an explanation anywhere.
Yes, exactly. Additionally, the user manual doesn't say anything too, just something about condensation in the engine. They could have written to check the 12V battery if it is so common issue.
 

m4in

Go Kart Newbie


.. according to google. Not knowing where the battery is really isn't an argument against the suggestion though.

I also though to check that screen when the popup appeared: there was nothing. Of course it was like that, because it is not considered a warning or an alarm.

Why would that not be a warning? "The engine needs to keep running" when trying to go into EV mode very much sounds like a warning to me. More so than a start/stop system not activating and not telling you anything at all until you go to the status screen explaining why it's not activating. I don't know whether or not MIB3 omitted that "feature", but absolutely i'd expect it to tell me why i can't go into EV mode.

I didn't say that it's a common issue (although, 12v systems in PHEVs in general seem to be more finnicky than in dinosaur burners, i get the impression), i'm just saying that it very much fits the symptoms. It could still be something entirely unrelated, it's just that the 12v would explain all the symptoms nicely.

Weather plays a role too, btw - getting colder now, i'd expect the issue to happen more often since the battery discharges faster/gets weaker in cold temperatures.
 

UPL02

New member
Why would that not be a warning? "The engine needs to keep running" when trying to go into EV mode very much sounds like a warning to me.
It sounds to me too, but probably not to software guys that work/worked at Volkswagen ;)

Anyway... surprise! Yesterday night I did another trip and the message did not appear and even this morning and evening it didn't appear.
After about 2 weeks with the "engine needs to keep running" popup at every startup and about 100-150 km in total (I didn't remember the exact day it first appeared, otherwise I could check) it went away on its own. :unsure: and I didn't charge the high voltage battery before doing the trip.
 

Maturedriver

Go Kart Champion
My car had a recall where the 12 volt battery module was replaced. If this issue is due to the 12 volt battery perhaps it might need the module replaced (under warranty).
 

UPL02

New member
Mmm, unfortunately yesterday the error came up again, and today it has not disappeared :cry:
Let's see for how many kilometers it will remain there.
 

jonfl

New member
Had the car in at the dealer on Thursday. Turns out that when they replaced the battery control module they charged up the 12v battery and the hybrid only issue (engine needs to run longer message) went away and the car ran fine in emode only.

The technician took the car for a drive and confirmed the issue still remained. He suspects fully charging the 12v battery is what fixed it briefly, so am booked on for a replacement 12v battery in a few weeks.

Will update here on the results.

Also getting the 1896 update (from 1890)
Just a quick update on this. Local dealer has now fixed the issue. The car now stays in e-mode.

They didn’t replace the 12v battery, but they had had a notification through from VW on how to fix this. Am not entirely sure what they did but the customer service guy said they applied some adaptations, whatever that is.

I’ll take it as they reprogrammed something 🤷‍♂️

By the sounds of it, with VW issuing a notification about this it seems like it’s now a known and potentially growing issue.

Also had the 1896 update. Now the Auto mode for brake regen feels less like it’s randomly braking and trying to kill me 👍
 

Massimo 2323

Drag Racing Champion
Have they updated the engine module with the newer software, by any chance?
If you have obd11 you can get this infotmstion. Thanks…👍
 

jonfl

New member
Have they updated the engine module with the newer software, by any chance?
If you have obd11 you can get this infotmstion. Thanks…👍
Does this file give you the answer? If not please give me a hint what am looking for.

File is an export from my odb11 app

If it is in there, which bit was it?
 
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