HVAC companies are becoming near scammers rant

[PerceivedShift]

My air-handler has been giving me issues for years, cheapo unit with a leaky coil. So, option #1 was to just replace the coil to get more life out of the existing system. Quote just to replace the coil: $3500 - $4500. Ok, ouch. Still waiting to hear back from them for a new Goodman system. Sounded like it would be anywhere between $15000-$20000 installed. Hot damn, at that price I'd need to start a HELOC to pay for this shit. Whats that? I can get a $2000 tax credit on the high end system? Is this something you have accounted for in your pricing? Ok, what about this other smaller HVAC company, maybe they are better? Quote for a basic system....$13000, quote for upgrade 16 SEER2 system which qualifies for tax credit....$16000. What's going on here...when I first started researching I was looking at a range between 6-10k installed. Turns out on /r/hvac subreddit I read that most of them up-charge 100% or more on equipment. Now this is starting to make sense. I've found entire systems for my home at hvacdirect.com for 3-$4k, now their $7000 equipment cost makes sense!

I get it, a company has to make a profit, but 100%+ markup? Welcome to the reality of subsidized industry. How much are they charging for labor? Wish I knew, receiving an itemized quote from these people is like pulling teeth and at the very least they are charging 6-9k for labor. An experienced installer could do it in a day, on his own. That would be $1000/hr. Now, im no hvac expert, but I do know their time isn't worth $1000/hr. Hot damn I work in the wrong industry.

At this point I want to give these companies the middle finger and install a DIY system from MrCool for $4-$5k installed. Most of the negative reviews of these systems seem to come from people who sell HVAC systems....who woulda thought. I could buy an entire spare system and still be way ahead in cost.

Rant over.

 

[Superfreak]

Not HVAC, but a neighbor of mine recently spent $120k on a replacement deck. Absolutely crazy. Installers will charge what customers will pay. Crazy world.

 

[GolNat]

Always get a 2nd or 3rd quote.

I had both of my house units replaced for 10k. Had quotes as high as 18k.

 

[KevinC]

Goodman is absolute garbage, never buy that crap unless you're planning on selling the house the week after. And yeah, these tactics suck, but have been going on in that industry (and many others) for ages.

 

[PerceivedShift]

Not HVAC, but a neighbor of mine recently spent $120k on a replacement deck. Absolutely crazy. Installers will charge what customers will pay. Crazy world.

120k on a deck...pool...and guest house?

Always get a 2nd or 3rd quote.

I had both of my house units replaced for 10k. Had quotes as high as 18k.

Two quotes so far, honestly just tired having them out my house just to quote me insane prices. Probably go DIY

Goodman is absolute garbage, never buy that crap unless you're planning on selling the house the week after. And yeah, these tactics suck, but have been going on in that industry (and many others) for ages.

Ooof really? The same company ripped into Trane and said they switched to Goodman. I guess installing junk gets more service calls, thus $$$$.

 

[brat_burner]

Yea scam.. I had a house with the a/c equipment in the attic. One company told me the furnace was rusted and I needed to spend 13K. I knew they were full of shit bc I had already been up there looking at it.

 

[PerceivedShift]

Yea scam.. I had a house with the a/c equipment in the attic. One company told me the furnace was rusted and I needed to spend 13K. I knew they were full of shit bc I had already been up there looking at it.

Just like bad car techs looking to rip people off. My GF had her 2009 Escape in for service and they "found" $4000 of work to fix several oil leaks. Declined the service and looked at her engine...a few small weeps around some gaskets and seals but that's it. Nothing to worry about to cause $4k of work.

They depend on their customers remaining ignorant and just paying up to keep their home air conditioned.

 

[virtualbong]

Yep, I hate them. There's a company called, "Rodenheiser" here in Massachusetts and it's a big scam. They put a lot of money into marketing so people feel like they are a decent company to go with but every time...the solution is..."Replace the entire HVAC system". My response, "Oh, ok, bye"

Luckily, I was out golfing one afternoon last summer and got paired with two dudes that ended up being independent HVAC people. They didn't have a nice van or anything but was a master technician instead of the cheapo, "I need a job" kids that work at these major companies.

 

[PerceivedShift]

Yep, I hate them. There's a company called, "Rodenheiser" here in Massachusetts and it's a big scam. They put a lot of money into marketing so people feel like they are a decent company to go with but every time...the solution is..."Replace the entire HVAC system". My response, "Oh, ok, bye"

Luckily, I was out golfing one afternoon last summer and got paired with two dudes that ended up being independent HVAC people. They didn't have a nice van or anything but was a master technician instead of the cheapo, "I need a job" kids that work at these major companies.

Or be the company I had quote to fix my system...$4000 to replace a bottom of the barrel coil is insane to me. They probably get the coil from their supplier for $600 and the job could be done in 3hrs or less. R410a is expensive, I get it, their cost would be $150 to top it off.

Also, I don't think "Master Tech" is a thing in HVAC, that's an ASE cert for automotive repair. I passed all exams back in 2010 to receive my ASE master tech cert which requires 12(?) or so exams to be passed at an exam center. To maintain your certifications you also need to retest every few years. We all know auto techs don't get paid well. HVAC has "Master Specialist Certifications" which are hands on tests in various areas of HVAC. To work on HVAC at a company you need to pass the EPA's 608 certification. I've taken Type I and it was cake....not sure about type II and III. As I understand it no re-tests are required.

Point is, barrier to entry in HVAC is actually much lower than automotive repair and many other industries while apparently paying incredibly well. I guess most people just don't wonna do it because its not glamorous, which makes sense as I can't get anyone in my family to take it on. With this enlightening experience, if I ever change careers again I know what I'll be doing lmao. I can deeply undercut the competition and still make a shit ton of money in my area.

 

[Charlotte.:R]

Doesn't help that prices have also doubled in a couple years. When we replaced our AC a few years ago, quotes were from $7500 -- $15,000. We went with the $7,500 option, then paid another $1500 or so to have someone fix all the crap they messed up on the install.

I don't trust anyone in the industry.

 

[Strange Mud]

as someone that fixes machinery for a living it's near impossible to get help. Many of the trades have this problem.

I enjoy my job and get decent $. Not bad for a HS graduate (+ 2yrs electrical school at the University of Uncle Sam).

 

[Daks]

Goodman is absolute garbage, never buy that crap unless you're planning on selling the house the week after. And yeah, these tactics suck, but have been going on in that industry (and many others) for ages.

They were purchased by Daikin a few years back. I think they are on the up and up.

 

[PerceivedShift]

as someone that fixes machinery for a living it's near impossible to get help. Many of the trades have this problem.

I enjoy my job and get decent $. Not bad for a HS graduate (+ 2yrs electrical school at the University of Uncle Sam).

I'm all for paying techs well, but their whole unwillingness to give me an itemized quote just screams "we are hiding our bill of materials and labor costs because we are ripping you off". We need more people to enter the skilled labor force and bring more competition, unfortunately most kids these days want to find some woke college only to get brainwashed for four years and 100k in debt.