The Fed
Old Guys Rule
I wouldn't care which party does this; I wouldn't like it.
The speed camera nightmare that's coming to America (msn.com)
The speed camera nightmare that's coming to America (msn.com)
8
Push to Install Speed Cameras in US
- Thread starter The Fed
- Start date
KevinC
Autocross Champion
Pothole Pete's idea? That knucklehead can't even fog a mirror.
We had speed cameras all over metro Phoenix & Scottsdale about 15 years ago. IMMENSELY unpopular with the public, especially as details came out about how the camera companies were earning a commission on the tickets. They were also monkeying with the yellow light timing on the ones at intersections to make it more likely you'd run the light. Then it came out that despite your mug showing up in the picture from a speed camera, all you had to do in court was testify under oath that it wasn't you in the picture. Case immediately dismissed as no way to disprove it. Also came out that if you threw the ticket in the trash, there was no followthrough to come after you. Doomed the program immediately and they were soon gone.
Just another revenue grab, nothing to do with public safety whatsoever. Resist this crap.
We had speed cameras all over metro Phoenix & Scottsdale about 15 years ago. IMMENSELY unpopular with the public, especially as details came out about how the camera companies were earning a commission on the tickets. They were also monkeying with the yellow light timing on the ones at intersections to make it more likely you'd run the light. Then it came out that despite your mug showing up in the picture from a speed camera, all you had to do in court was testify under oath that it wasn't you in the picture. Case immediately dismissed as no way to disprove it. Also came out that if you threw the ticket in the trash, there was no followthrough to come after you. Doomed the program immediately and they were soon gone.
Just another revenue grab, nothing to do with public safety whatsoever. Resist this crap.
jimlloyd40
Autocross Champion
Some cities still have both speed and red light cameras in AZ. Not like it was though.
Sc0oter
Ready to race!
Double edged sword. I have always been adamantly against cameras and big brother. We had stop light cams for a time. Stories were circulating of lights short cycling (very little yellow time) and unfair ticketing. Of course the people in charge denied it. I had seen these yellow lights though I never got a ticket from them. A few years later we voted the cameras out but now everyone runs the red lights. No cameras and fewer police who don’t have time to deal with them. I don’t want the cameras back, just want people to quit driving like idiots. Too many gruesome accidents at stoplights now. Even more fearsome that I have kids starting to drive. Teaching them to count to 5 when the light turns green before proceeding.
gixxerfool
Autocross Champion
Same situation in NJ. They were pulled after a few years for the same reasons. What I have seen lately instead is all lights stay red for a few seconds before they go green. I’m a fan of this method over the money grab.
In my city in SoCal they were received by the city gov with great enthusiasm because it looked like it would be a great deterrent (red light cams) and a revenue generator.
They lasted about 2 years and have since disappeared, same story in most cities. They turned out to be a budget drain instead of a revenue generator. The companies that provided the service had contract minimums to cover basic cost of deployment, maint, monitoring and personnel to view and verify each possible infraction. They would install it in an intersection and infractions would go down very quickly and each site would very quickly be unable to provide enough revenue to be self supporting.
The problem with the model is it was too expensive to operate because it is not an automated system and required an enormous amount of labor to run. Even charging 500 bucks or so per violation it just didn't work and many cities ended up paying out a bunch of money.
They lasted about 2 years and have since disappeared, same story in most cities. They turned out to be a budget drain instead of a revenue generator. The companies that provided the service had contract minimums to cover basic cost of deployment, maint, monitoring and personnel to view and verify each possible infraction. They would install it in an intersection and infractions would go down very quickly and each site would very quickly be unable to provide enough revenue to be self supporting.
The problem with the model is it was too expensive to operate because it is not an automated system and required an enormous amount of labor to run. Even charging 500 bucks or so per violation it just didn't work and many cities ended up paying out a bunch of money.
dtfd
Autocross Champion
In Chicago they have both speed and red light cameras. The camera tickets the car, and the registered owner of the car, NOT the driver. This is an important distinction because the AZ defense of "prove it was me" doesn't apply, instead all the city has to prove is this is your car, and it went 5 mph over. (tickets start at 5mph now)
Meanwhile suburbs surrounding Chicago have taken down their red light cameras because they put them up to "save lives" and after running them for years have not seen a decrease in people running the lights at the intersection. They've actually seen INCREASES in accidents in some intersection (rear end events) because people slam their brakes in a situation where it may have been safer to move forward in order to avoid getting a ticket. It's almost like people don't purposefully run red lights so the logic of saving lives was flawed from the beginning.
Meanwhile suburbs surrounding Chicago have taken down their red light cameras because they put them up to "save lives" and after running them for years have not seen a decrease in people running the lights at the intersection. They've actually seen INCREASES in accidents in some intersection (rear end events) because people slam their brakes in a situation where it may have been safer to move forward in order to avoid getting a ticket. It's almost like people don't purposefully run red lights so the logic of saving lives was flawed from the beginning.
Many years ago I worked in Frankfurt for an airline that had a carpool. You just walked the lot, picked the car you wanted and put down a credit card to cover the taxes on it. One of my first trips there, I checked out a BMW 525i with a manual (because nearly everything had a manual at the time) and a coworker and I set out to see Porsche in Stuttgart, the Cayman had just been announced and we were hoping to see one (which we did.) We minded our manners in Frankfurt, got to the unrestricted section of the AB and then had fun, all the way to Stuttgart, where we exited, took a roundabout at an absurd speed, got caught off guard by a blinding camera flash going off, wondered what that was all about, and promptly forgot about it. Until I turned the car in and got the bill, which was normally thirty of forty euros for a three week rental. This time it was about 500 euros and had neatly detailed each speeding ticket I'd gotten in restricted zones. Oopsie. No court, no chance to fight it, just solid German efficiency, right there on your bill.
1ashchuckton
Autocross Champion
We had red light cameras here. It didn't take long for everyone to figure out where they were. So people would stop in theses locations & do what they liked everywhere else. The cameras are now gone.
People run red lights due to their heads being stuck in their phone. I wish they would enforce the distracted driving statutes that we have in place. Although most police cars are being driven by an officer on the phone so that is quite unlikely. Such is life & so it goes.....
People run red lights due to their heads being stuck in their phone. I wish they would enforce the distracted driving statutes that we have in place. Although most police cars are being driven by an officer on the phone so that is quite unlikely. Such is life & so it goes.....