Stage2Sasquatch
Go Kart Champion
It's significantly faster than the GTI w/PP on track and right there with the Civic Type R. So I'd say it's a solid car so far. We'll see what the pricing is when it comes out.
8
Hyundai Veloster N in the same breath as VW GTI
- Thread starter DAS_STIG
- Start date
BronxBomber
Ready to race!
I agree. The I30N, on which the. Veloster N is based on, has gotten rave reviews from the Euro and Australian car press. According to Hyundai, car should come by n right around 30K, which in typical Hyundai fashion undercuts the competition. Hey say it’s gonna give the GTI a run for its money on all fronts. Oh, and for the Euro/VW snobs, it’ll actually come with real leather seats for he price. Just saying
RacingManiac
Drag Race Newbie
Considering also MK7.5 puts the price point of PP equipment north of 30k MSRP, GTI was not the deal it used to be....
Personally, I dont care much for the exterior styling of the stinger - its all over the place. That being said, that car is getting some great reviews. I think the best thing Kia could do is making Stinger its own brand to get away from that shitty Kia badge that's associated with mini-vans and soccer moms. lol
Always a possibility. I would not underestimate the Koreans, though. Their business ethos is pretty aggressive, and usually pretty savvy. They're also pretty sensitive to appearances, it seems. Having some performance cred (and with Genesis, luxury cred too) is important to them I think, for reasons that can't be easily reduced to a spreadsheet.
I'm encouraged so far by what I've seen. The Stinger is too big and a bit out of my stylistic wheelhouse for me, but the Genesis G70 for instance is a very compelling looking sports sedan. The Veloster is a fugly car any way you look at it, but the N model seems to be doing the right things at least.
Hell, they sell enough basic people movers that they can sure afford to indulge in some halo stuff.
NopeR
Autocross Champion
My wife bought an elentra back in 2012 (one step below the limited edition with leather/nav). The reviews were amazing, awards being won, blah blah blah. Car felt like it was falling apart after a year of ownership. In less than 15k kms the stuts were toast, the dash was rattling like crazy, doors didn't seal properly anymore, etc...
Again, if you want to spend $60k (cdn) on a car, why the fuck would you even consider a Hyundai?
Again, if you want to spend $60k (cdn) on a car, why the fuck would you even consider a Hyundai?
Everyone's experience will be different, sure. But consider that when the Japanese started selling cars in North America, the vehicles were terrible. They rusted out. The were not manufactured well. The fell apart. The Japanese learned, over time, things like how to rust-proof cars for our dismal climates, and developed some of the world's cutting-edge manufacturing techniques. It didn't happen overnight.
Now, look at the Koreans. When they began selling cars here, yeah, they didn't exactly hit the ground running. Over the past several years, though, by whatever metric you use (in terms of surveys, reviews, auditing, whatever), Hyundai and Kia have made really strong progress in owner satisfaction, overall quality, and have now even started impressing the enthusiast community somewhat. It's a very similar pattern to how the Japanese made their climb.
There is no guarantee, of course, that the Koreans can reproduce the success of the Japanese. The times are different, and the competition is far more fierce. But then, the Koreans also aren't stupid. They won't reinvent the wheel, so to speak, but will harvest the knowledge and the experience of other folks, American, European, and Asian, to avoid some of the mistakes the Japanese made. Will it work? I think in terms of mass-market cars, it's already worked. In terms of being thought of in the same way that Audi or BMW is thought of, that remains to be seen. It's going to be tough enough to get to the point where Genesis is seen as the same level as Lexus, for instance, but it's certainly doable.
And some other folks have criticized the Koreans for being "copy cats." Well, in a business like cars, _everyone_ is a copy cat. That's how the industry works. Anything that works, that's not nailed down by patents, is going to be cloned, and even if it is patented, it's pretty likely that the underlying engineering can't be. There isn't a feature on one company's cars that isn't in some way shared with that on another company's vehicles, I'm betting. And every company is working both sides of that--innovating and having innovations siphoned off by competitors, and at the same time scooping up know-how from their rivals. Originality is much over-rated.
That was my experience driving a 2 year old, 20K mile Kia K900.
I couldn't believe it.
I *know* what the Japanese stuff will do over time. I'm currently testing for myself what the German stuff will do over time.
Absolutely. The differences between my mom's 1972 Toyota and my 1992 Civic Si were monumental.
But think this through. Hyundai has had since 1986 to hash this out--that's 32 years. But a few years ago, they couldn't make a top of the line Kia to any sort of standards such that it would last 20K miles/2 years.
That Hyundai had the opportunity is not in question. That they squandered the opportunity to do what Honda did back in the 90s--that's what's in play here.
If they can't figure it out in 25-32 years, then when? How long?
In the meantime, just because it says "hot hatch, competes with GTI" on it is meaningless. GTI is more than a hot hatch. It's a storied brand with a long history. Sure, if all you want is to borrow the Elantra N for a weekend drive and hoon it around, fine. But do you want to buy it, knowing how Hyundai has failed to develop like Honda did over a similar time period?
Reasonable points, though I do think the anecdotal evidence presented here is somewhat at odds with other data out there about Kia and Hyundai cars. And I could dig up as many anecdotes that are on the other end of the spectrum (and plenty of anecdotes that pillory VWs, Audis, and BMWs for quality control issues).
Neither Kia nor Hyundai actually makes a car I'm interested in at this point (Genesis is an exception, as I would definitely at least consider a G70). I don't necessarily agree that the Koreans haven't made significant progress over the past couple of decades, either, but that's a subjective evaluation and without a ton more data than either of us have, it's sort of a moot point. I do agree 100% that for a lot of car buyers, there is still a real skepticism about these cars and the companies. Whether that skepticism is warranted or not I cannot say, but it certainly is there.
mesaboogie18
Ready to race!
I've had a few Hyundai vehicles over the years and they've all been great. More reliable than my VWs and cheaper to boot. I bought a 2017 Tucson Sport last year and it's been wonderful. The 1.6T, while no EA888, of course, has plenty of power for a compact crossover. The 7-speed DCT has been smooth and fun to drive as well. It has some characteristics of a manual transmission that I like, such as engine braking on deceleration. If the I30N were coming here, I'd trade in my 2017 SE in a heartbeat. My MK7 may actually be the last VW I buy.
Last edited: