my tuned GTI suffered a catastrophic engine failure...

[jimlloyd40]

Sure. But I can do my due diligence to exhaust all resources to help myself. Who's above regional manager?

VWOA and they made their decision when they slapped TD1 on your car.

Sorry but I've got to take the manufacturers side on this topic. You deliberately altered the engine management system to produce more power. The manufacturer can't be held responsible for changing it. You would lose in court also. All you can do is ask for help with the cost. If you decide on court it will cost more than just fixing or replacing the engine.

 

[swcrow]

VWOA and they made their decision when they slapped TD1 on your car.

Sorry but I've got to take the manufacturers side on this topic. You deliberately altered the engine management system to produce more power. The manufacturer can't be held responsible for changing it. You would lose in court also. All you can do is ask for help with the cost. If you decide on court it will cost more than just fixing or replacing the engine.

The unfortunate point of where the rubber meets the road of "pay to play"

 

[GTIfan99]

Thanks very much for clearing my head, @cb1111!

According to my USA Warranty and Maintenance booklet, in the section on "What's not covered" on page 7, it says:

Damage or malfunction due the misuse, negligence, alteration, accident, vandalism, or fire
This limited warranty does not cover:

• Damage, malfunctions, or symptoms resulting from modifications of the vehicle, including but not limited to the installation of engine management components, not approved by Volkswagen

From the language, doesn't the dealer have the burden of proof to show a software tune directly caused my engine damage/failure? By extension of the statement above, there exists "damages NOT resulted from the installed engine management components modifications."

What happens if I tell the dealer that, what proof do you have that it is the software tune that caused my engine failure, not a "defect in manufacturer's material or workmanship"? Can you say conclusively that ALL engine failures like mine that you've seen are from tuned vehicles?

They do, and you'd have to take them to court. In this case, they would win, as again, knock and excessive heat is what breaks ringlands. Do you have evidence of what your knock was pre and post tunes? EGT's, etc...

Even if your did, it's a long road.

This is the reason I always buy at mod friendly dealer and have them do all the servicing. I go by once a week and utilize the free car wash they offer and talk about cars, racing, and shoot the shit. One of the service writers what having an issue getting an appointment at our radiology center. I took care of it for him.

I can't say if they'll cover my engine if I have a failure like yours, but in the past, with other brands, I've gotten a ridiculous amount of stuff covered that they could have told be to pack sand. I also tend to buy from the same couple dealers. VW in St. Augustine and Subaru of Jacksonville. I have friends that work at both that I autocross with also.

Think about it from a dealer standpoint. Why would you help some dude off the street that you don't know?

And I'm not joking about my suggestion. Have a good indy shop look at the cylinder walls. Based on you documentation, they didn't see any head or cylinder wall damage with the scope. If they aren't trashed, hone, replace piston, and either sell it or drive it till it dies on the stock tune.

By the time it dies again, the car will be worth more as a part out than you could sell it for.

The STI I did that to is still kicking 10 years later. It's all about the condition of the cylinder wall.

 

[jimlloyd40]

And most importantly if this went to court the burden of proof of what caused the failure would be on the car owner. The manufacturer simply needs to prove that the engine control unit was modified.

 

[GTIfan99]

And most importantly if this went to court the burden of proof of what caused the failure would be on the car owner. The manufacturer simply needs to prove that the engine control unit was modified.

I'm not quite sure that's the letter of the law, but in application of the law, I agree. In this case, it's wouldn't matter, the dealer has an open and shut defense. ECU was altered and the factory ECU was no longer able to operate within factory perimeters, which are designed to prevent knock and excessive heat. As a bonus, you'll get to pay THEIR legal costs.

OP, hone, new piston, flash back to stock, move on with your life.

 

[D.Gage]

Sure. But I can do my due diligence to exhaust all resources to help myself. Who's above regional manager?

The assistant to the regional manager

 

[cospringsalltrack]

The assistant to the regional manager

no, its the assistant regional manager

 

[cb1111]

My M2 is a [Leica] film camera built in the 60s haha.

Older Leica cameras, depending model/condition, can cost upward of $10K+ for the body alone. Lenses are another story altogether.

But you’re right about my wife. Thank you!

Mine is a IIIg and a couple of SL2's and a handful of lenses - but most of my film stuff is Nikon

 

[morgan]

While I qualify the independent shops in my area, what do I say to each shop when I call? I need to "rebuild the engine"? I don't want to do multiple tows to different shops just so they can look at the car. I probably need to decide on one by talking to them over the phone and checking their Google reviews. TIA.

 

[morgan]

Also, initial search shows A3 engines to be $1-2K cheaper than GTI engines. Why is that? Any A3 engine would be able to be swapped in, if I go that route?

 

[GTIfan99]

While I qualify the independent shops in my area, what do I say to each shop when I call? I need to "rebuild the engine"? I don't want to do multiple tows to different shops just so they can look at the car. I probably need to decide on one by talking to them over the phone and checking their Google reviews. TIA.

Is there a local VW group Facebook page? If so, they will be able to steer you to the better indy shops in the area.

Also, this forum has some regional forums I think. Ask for shop recommendations in there too.

 

[swcrow]

Also, initial search shows A3 engines to be $1-2K cheaper than GTI engines. Why is that? Any A3 engine would be able to be swapped in, if I go that route?

Split the A3 engine into short block/head.....see if numbers match the GTI's. My old Passat 1.8T AWM engine, when separated, was an exact match to Audi's, but put together, and the long block numbers were different.

 

[volks6]

TD1 doesn't mean "your warranty is void", it means "dealer, this owner has modified the ECU that may, or may not, have caused problems."

For VW and Audi TD1 means you need a new engine. There's no getting around it. So you are wrong and really should stop putting out there false hope. This isn't a water pump assembly being replaced on a TD1'd engine. It's the whole freaking engine because of an engine tune gone bad. Hence the TD1. The ECM is modified and that's the end.

Thanks very much for clearing my head, @cb1111!

According to my USA Warranty and Maintenance booklet, in the section on "What's not covered" on page 7, it says:

Damage or malfunction due the misuse, negligence, alteration, accident, vandalism, or fire
This limited warranty does not cover:

• Damage, malfunctions, or symptoms resulting from modifications of the vehicle, including but not limited to the installation of engine management components, not approved by Volkswagen

From the language, doesn't the dealer have the burden of proof to show a software tune directly caused my engine damage/failure? By extension of the statement above, there exists "damages NOT resulted from the installed engine management components modifications."

What happens if I tell the dealer that, what proof do you have that it is the software tune that caused my engine failure, not a "defect in manufacturer's material or workmanship"? Can you say conclusively that ALL engine failures like mine that you've seen are from tuned vehicles?

They have the proof through the TD1. That's their burden of proof. The ECM was changed from stock leading to ring-land failure due to increased knock.

Again I'll state. Sure it sucks you need a new engine but as the saying goes you pay to play.
Lick your wounds and bite the bullet and take responsibility for the decisions you made by going the tuning route you did. Replace the engine and look for blame else where because IT'S NOT VWOA RESPONSIBILITY TO FIX PROBLEMS YOU MADE TUNING YOUR ENGINE.
End thread. </>

 

[swcrow]

While I qualify the independent shops in my area, what do I say to each shop when I call? I need to "rebuild the engine"? I don't want to do multiple tows to different shops just so they can look at the car. I probably need to decide on one by talking to them over the phone and checking their Google reviews. TIA.

I have a good buddy in Bellevue....I'll PM you his number...he can direct you...huge VW nerd

 

[Strange Mud]

too early to ask about part out?



Mud